ADMIN, Youth Camp

[Man BG]

Just hurry up with that CANCEL button!

 

[princessq]

I am not agree with the  RayLei (in chinese, Louzu). Acturally I support with ADMIN for this update.
Youth Camp is a new thing, It benefit some people. That's all! But it will not impact the balance of GKO.

1.100 fresh 9/4, it's not enough to impact the balance. count the 9/4 or higher exist in GKO. 100 is not a big number. and LA 9 is not the final LA limit. you can even expect more, LA 12, LA13...
2. Good player always went to greater club. if they don't gather it from academy/Youth Camp, they will buy it from market. No doubt they have enough money to do so.
3. we can expect the next round. many greate club will spend more money to Youth Camp for the 9/4. it will be fair as the greatest investment will generate the greater player.
4. About the academy, it's different things with Youth Camp. you cannot just compare this two function/facilites. with the best academy you got the best youth player, while there is another way Youth Camp. you can even invest academy and Youth Camp in the same time.

[shomyguca]

1.100 fresh 9/4, it's not enough to impact the balance. count the 9/4 or higher exist in GKO. 100 is not a big number. and LA 9 is not the final LA limit. you can even expect more, LA 12, LA13...

I agree, but it makes me fill like donkey not to have a single LA9 from my VG academy, and soneone get it for 100k. My Investment to academy is about 6M!

2. Good player always went to greater club. if they don't gather it from academy/Youth Camp, they will buy it from market. No doubt they have enough money to do so.

You can not buy a player if he isn't on TL, no matter how much money you have. This is not real life, players don't have emotions and wishes. They will play and be happy about it for every team that gives him proper salary.

3. we can expect the next round. many greate club will spend more money to Youth Camp for the 9/4. it will be fair as the greatest investment will generate the greater player.

Since there is allot of brainless people playing this game, I expect them to invest a million and go to bankruptcy just "see" LA9 player in their squads. Their teams will be shut down, and good teams will not have good players.

4. About the academy, it's different things with Youth Camp. you cannot just compare this two function/facilites. with the best academy you got the best youth player, while there is another way Youth Camp. you can even invest academy and Youth Camp in the same time.

My main point: I have VG academy, VG stadium with 22500 seats and I play Top level in Serbia. I earn from tickets 300k in the best case (league+friendly) and my expenses are 115k. Difference is 185k, which means that I can invest about 60k/week in 3 camps and earn nothing. So I CAN'T invest into the camps and the academy at the same time, because if I invest less then 60k, I can't compete reckless managers, and if I invest more, I can forget the best academy! Please think before you write! And how is it possible that team with bed infrastructure could invest more than that 60k??? Simply, it's manager doesn't think at all, rushing into the bankruptcy! I'm not complaining, I just want that CANCEL button on camps, and I want it as soon as possible since camps take from me 10k/week (2x5k) and I don't want to give away that money!!!

[raketa]

In countries where a large number of manager investment give the 10 players with large LA and 20 players with midle LA. In countries where a low number of manager  investment  with great yielded 2  players with large LA and 2 player with middle LA. Or something proportionally. Then the teams that are on top of investments receive the best players and everyone is happy

[top level]

In countries where a large number of manager investment give the 10 players with large LA and 20 players with midle LA. In countries where a low number of manager  investment  with great yielded 2  players with large LA and 2 player with middle LA. Or something proportionally. Then the teams that are on top of investments receive the best players and everyone is happy[/size][/color]

first of all, no need to double-post.
then: you misunderstood, in countries with low investment there will be zero large LA players. would you invest any amount of money in a small country, to have no chance of getting a large LA player, or would you prefer to invest the same amount in a large country, to have a chance of getting a large LA player?

[shomyguca]

first of all, no need to double-post.
then: you misunderstood, in countries with low investment there will be zero large LA players. would you invest any amount of money in a small country, to have no chance of getting a large LA player, or would you prefer to invest the same amount in a large country, to have a chance of getting a large LA player?

Second of all, I already created a camp in a small country! Tell me the way to replace it with the one in large country, and I'll do it! For God sake, think before you write!!!

[top level]

if you need a translation of admin´s post, here it is: large countries will get the same kind of players (1 x LA 10, some LA 9 and so on), the small countries will have significantly weaker players. do you think ˝significantly˝ means LA 9? i bet it´s lower than 8, maybe lower than 7. does it worth for any team that wants to get stronger to invest 3x5.000 g a week in such players, when you can buy a 2/6/3 for 10.000 - 15.000 g?
or maybe even less, if you´re a good shopper.

[Kr10s]

if you need a translation of admin´s post, here it is: large countries will get the same kind of players (1 x LA 10, some LA 9 and so on), the small countries will have significantly weaker players. do you think ˝significantly˝ means LA 9? i bet it´s lower than 8, maybe lower than 7. does it worth for any team that wants to get stronger to invest 3x5.000 g a week in such players, when you can buy a 2/6/3 for 10.000 - 15.000 g?
or maybe even less, if you´re a good shopper.

Many people invested BEFORE admin's announcement, and still CAN'T cancel that youth camp.
Not to menction that Youth camps were released without any docs to explain how they works.
What should they do? Reduce their weekly investment to 5.000G and let it be? They need a fair solution, i don't think they should get their investment back (they received a player after all) but they should have the chance to fix their situation under this new and unexpected scenario, don't you think?

[chuncho_]

sorry but I think you did not understand, now says the adm. that only large countries best players take out the camps? ... can not be

why not said before, it's crazy ..

at least if it starts hurting less tool to remove the camp, but this is small, considering the loss of money and time that each spent without having a real-time information, if any changes ... changes everything becomes a joke right?

[shomyguca]

Thanks Carlos for explaining my point! And for a moment, I taught I wasn't clear enough!  Now I know it wasn't up to me!

[top level]

Many people invested BEFORE admin's announcement, and still CAN'T cancel that youth camp.
Not to menction that Youth camps were released without any docs to explain how they works.
What should they do? Reduce their weekly investment to 5.000G and let it be? They need a fair solution, i don't think they should get their investment back (they received a player after all) but they should have the chance to fix their situation under this new and unexpected scenario, don't you think?

i never said anything about changing countries or canceling camps.

i´m not talking about reducing the investment to 5.000 and still receiving good players.

i´m not saying it´s ok not having a cancel button, i´m not saying it´s ok to launch a feature without enough information about it.

shomyguca probably assumed i meant everybody can or should move the current investment to the top investment countries. that is impossible for the moment.

i only talked about new camps. there are plenty of users out there that still have empty slots for youth camps. i have 3, shomyguca has 1, for example. the fact that there was insufficient info about the camps made me wait to see what happens and then take a decision. there must be quite a few users out there with the same approach. now i´ve got the news that if i want a high LA player, i should go for a high investment in a top country. otherwise, any investment, anywhere else, just brings shitty players (yes, LA 8 is a shitty player for my development plan).

[shomyguca]

I´m not saying it´s ok to launch a feature without enough information about it.

That's exactly what I was talking about. I feel trapped. I created 2 camps, afterwards I calculated that I can't compete with managers who invest all their money into the camps without thinking, and now I want to stop investing, but I can't. Now I'm losing 10k/week. That's what pisses me off!

shomyguca probably assumed i meant everybody can or should move the current investment to the top investment countries. that is impossible for the moment.

Yes, that was my assumption. Sorry for misunderstanding, but I couldn't possibly know that you were talking about managers with no camps at the moment.

I only talked about new camps. there are plenty of users out there that still have empty slots for youth camps. i have 3, shomyguca has 1, for example.

Whole this idea with camps is not good, on my opinion. Everybody will chase players from camps, and club's infrastructure will suffer (academy, stadium...). But everybody will have to choose whether he wants to invest camp or infrastructure. I chose to stop investing into the camps and continue with infrastructure, but I can't. Offering 0G/week would satisfy me. When I finish with infrastructure, then I would probably continue with camp.

[Brian Clough]

Lacking a "close camp" option, I wonder how long until managers start creating ghost clubs just to inflate the amount invested in the countries where they have youth camps? Action is needed, and soon. Some suggestions I have for the development of this feature:

1. Provide a 0G investment option, but not a "close" button. If a youth camp goes 3-4 consecutive weeks without any investment, it is closed. One week prior to its closing, a warning would be sent to the manager in club news. Once closed, the investment still counts toward overall national investment, but the club has to start over at zero (0) if the manager were to rebuild a camp in the same nation.
 
2. Each week after weekly investment is paid, the investment setting automatically resets to zero. Managers have to manually re-set their weekly investment each week.

3. If a club is in debt, all investment in youth camps should be suspended until the club is out of debt. If the club remains in debt for too long, its youth camps start closing.

In addition to providing a way to finally close a youth camp, nos. 1 & 2 would minimize investments from banned and inactive managers. Also this prevents managers from rapidly building and closing camps in search of the "right" country. Once a youth camp is built, you are stuck with it for at least 3-4 weeks. No. 3 should prevent (inactive) teams from investing heavily when they don't have the funds. It also helps keep high youth camp fees from driving (active) clubs into bankruptcy.

What do you think?
 

[top level]

do you really think they will be able to create such complicated algorithm? i mean, we´re talking about the same guys that have no clue how to make a close camp button...

but your points are valid, especially the one about ghost clubs.

[shomyguca]

Brian, your solution is quiet good. But in my case, it would create small problem. Anyway, I would like to stop my investment in camps for the moment and continue when I finish investing into academy. If it's applied your rule of 3 week cancellation, I would have to increase to 5k every third week in order not to lose my camps. That would be quiet big preoccupation. It could eventually happen that I forget to change amount or not to be able to log in GKO.
That's one point of view, but anyway, your solution is much better then present situation and I support it!

[Littmann]

sorry but I think you did not understand, now says the adm. that only large countries best players take out the camps? ... can not be

why not said before, it's crazy ..

at least if it starts hurting less tool to remove the camp, but this is small, considering the loss of money and time that each spent without having a real-time information, if any changes ... changes everything becomes a joke right?

I don't know about what you are talking. Season started (first match) 10/04/2013. This announcement was released 03/04/2013.
That is 7 days before.

- Youth camp

- You can build up to 3 youth camps in any countries (but not your country)  without any cost but you have to pay maintenance fee on a weekly basis (at least 5,000 G per week).

- On Thursday at 06:00:00 (server time), each club has to invest an amount of money on every youth camp that it owns.

- If the amount of money is not enough to deduct, only 5,000 G will be invested for that week.

-  Your Investment will be accumulated up to 2 seasons.
E.g. First year invest 50,000 G -> cumulative investment = 50,000 G
Second year invest 100,000 G -> cumulative investment = 150,000 G
Third year invest 200,000 G -> cumulative investment = 300,000 G
Fourth year invest 100,000 G -> cumulative investment = 300,000 G

- In each country, every youth camp will be ranked based on the cumulative investment of each club.

- The total investment on youth camps of each country will affect the ability of youth players in that country.

- Between the 9th week to 15th week of league competition, youth competitions will be held to search for young talents.
Each youth camp will sign a player and send that player to the club automatically.

- Another youth competitions will be held between the 25th week to 30th week of league competition to select another youth player for each club.

- Therefore, each youth camp will send 2 youth players to the club every season.

- A youth player will choose to join a club based on the ranking of the club's camp that suit his ability.

This was obviously a BUG which helped to clubs who invested low amount of money. They profited much more than us who were kept this written rules. They want to fix this bug? What is wrong? To me,only Cancel button. ONLY!

[Brian Clough]

This was obviously a BUG which helped to clubs who invested low amount of money. They profited much more than us who were kept this written rules. They want to fix this bug? What is wrong? To me,only Cancel button. ONLY!

IMO this BUG was a good one because of the lack of information about youth camps and the general lack of development with this feature. Until the first full period when camps can be closed and more information is available about investments in different countries, the gap between the highest investors/biggest nations and lowest investors/smallest nations should be relatively small. Widen the gap only after this feature is fully developed, I say.

For me, the problem with a cancel button is how it would enable any manager to open and close youth camps in an unlimited number of nations without cost or time constraint. Thus if a cancel button were introduced, there would need to be a cost for camp creation and/or destruction. Since everyone was able to start youth camps for free so far, it must be a cancellation cost. Personally, I'd like to see these remain without cost, but then, "time is money", so both options would have the same net effect I think.

Finally, national statistics on youth camp investment should be published...in premium game statistics.

[Ruta]

Lacking a "close camp" option, I wonder how long until managers start creating ghost clubs just to inflate the amount invested in the countries where they have youth camps? Action is needed, and soon. Some suggestions I have for the development of this feature:

2. Each week after weekly investment is paid, the investment setting automatically resets to zero. Managers have to manually re-set their weekly investment each week.

3. If a club is in debt, all investment in youth camps should be suspended until the club is out of debt. If the club remains in debt for too long, its youth camps start closing.

In addition to providing a way to finally close a youth camp, nos. 1 & 2 would minimize investments from banned and inactive managers. Also this prevents managers from rapidly building and closing camps in search of the "right" country. Once a youth camp is built, you are stuck with it for at least 3-4 weeks. No. 3 should prevent (inactive) teams from investing heavily when they don't have the funds. It also helps keep high youth camp fees from driving (active) clubs into bankruptcy.

I dont  know why this post is without any comments? This is so important, cause "ghost camps" is another way to cheat. As we know this game is full of cheaters. I can see multi-acconts settled juss because of invest in one country.
Very important is that teams with debts shouldn't can invest in Camps,too.

For me, the problem with a cancel button is how it would enable any manager to open and close youth camps in an unlimited number of nations without cost or time constraint. Thus if a cancel button were introduced, there would need to be a cost for camp creation and/or destruction. Since everyone was able to start youth camps for free so far, it must be a cancellation cost. Personally, I'd like to see these remain without cost, but then, "time is money", so both options would have the same net effect I think.

good point,too

Finally, national statistics on youth camp investment should be published...in premium game statistics.

I like your idea very much. This is a good way for premium feature.

[shomyguca]

Finally, national statistics on youth camp investment should be published...in premium game statistics.

I like your idea very much. This is a good way for premium feature.

Yes, all for the premium! So the rest of us non-premium players can just quit with this game!

[chespis]

if a cancel button were introduced, there would need to be a cost for camp creation and/or destruction

Dude, remember that if you create another camp, you have to start again adding money to it. So  I think that is a cost Enough, to destroy a camp and create a new one, for example in my case, if I want to destroy my Paraguay's camp I lose 1505000 G

[Kr10s]

Finally, national statistics on youth camp investment should be published...in premium game statistics.

I like your idea very much. This is a good way for premium feature.

Yes, all for the premium! So the rest of us non-premium players can just quit with this game!

In fact, i think it would be an interesting premium feature,  the "in game advantage" you receive is not that much, or better said, it's not a feature related with your team's stats.
If you are not premium, you can ask that info to any premium, in the same way that non-premium NT managers collect info to develop their player list.

+1 to Brian's suggestion.

[Brian Clough]

if a cancel button were introduced, there would need to be a cost for camp creation and/or destruction

Dude, remember that if you create another camp, you have to start again adding money to it. So  I think that is a cost Enough, to destroy a camp and create a new one, for example in my case, if I want to destroy my Paraguay's camp I lose 1505000 G

To clarify, any closure cost would only serve to prevent managers from opening and closing camps without limit to find the "perfect one". We couldn't scroll through nations when we built our camps, and future managers should not have this option either, I think.

Finally, national statistics on youth camp investment should be published...in premium game statistics.

I like your idea very much. This is a good way for premium feature.

Yes, all for the premium! So the rest of us non-premium players can just quit with this game!

Or, you could just send a message to a premium manager with a request for this information, I'm sure it is easy to find one that would help. 

[shomyguca]

Ok, you made your point. You're right. I'm just pissed off with buying advantages in this game. Yes, this one wouldn't change too much.

[Brian Clough]

Already ghost camps appear to be sprouting  Just look at Afghanistan chat.

[Levan]

This camp is ruining my strategy, I invested a lot of money (relatively of course for my team and league) in academy and now It makes little seance, Players from Youth camp are much stronger what I can dream off getting in my academy so Academy makes no sense anymore for me at least. I think after this season they should scrap this Youth camp