Author Topic: Training on NT  (Read 4294 times)

Sopelana

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Training on NT
« on: September 19, 2014, 07:48:39 PM »
Hello to everybody,

I was asking myself why when a bot NT plays some of the best players could not play, and of course don't receive training. I was thinking about it, and I think it's frustrating when your player is better (maybe in long terms) and he doens't play. 

So, I have a suggestion about training on NT. For me, all players who don't play and are on the list, should receive training like youth on league matches.

I know, that some NT coaches could call their players to receive that extra training, but I think is just for all to receive something when you have a NT player who doesn't play.

Maybe, this is not the rigth place to put this post (it should be on suggestion) but first of all I want to discuss about this idea, before post there.

Thanks in advance to all for your participation at this post.
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Brian Clough

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Re: Training on NT
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2014, 12:31:14 AM »
great suggestion!  8)
« Last Edit: September 20, 2014, 03:51:15 AM by Brian Clough »
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kaisser

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Re: Training on NT
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2014, 03:36:05 AM »
good idea!

Ruta

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Re: Training on NT
« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2014, 04:10:39 AM »
At 1st sight it looks very nice:) But I think that effect of game training in nation teams should be lower. I don' t know how much, to 75% or 50%. Players with NT caps have too much adventage now. Beside training they get somuch exp, too
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mathieu29

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Re: Training on NT
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2014, 08:06:41 AM »
I agree with Ruta. I have players that have been playing for 10 seasons (but no international cap) with less experience than young  international players from my team.
Experience gained in international game is already huge, compared to what players gain in championship. Let's not do it even bigger.
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Sopelana

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Re: Training on NT
« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2014, 08:28:06 AM »
I agree with Ruta. I have players that have been playing for 10 seasons (but no international cap) with less experience than young  international players from my team.
Experience gained in international game is already huge, compared to what players gain in championship. Let's not do it even bigger.

I'm only speaking about training, that players will not raise experience. And the training of youth on league is very insignificant (residual).

But, how many of us have a DMC (AMC....) on bot NT that will never play and we are fustrated for that?. At least, in this way, he will recive something, a little bit of training. Is something more mental than the real improvement of the player.

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top level

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Re: Training on NT
« Reply #6 on: September 20, 2014, 11:23:56 AM »
while i agree from the point of view of amc's, amr's and this sort of positions that can't play in bot teams, altogether i have to categorize the idea as detrimental, because of cheater nt and u21 coaches, that will bring ridiculous players from their teams or their friend's teams, only to get undeserved training.

in Romania, we've already had this problem, last season, when zsoka (nt) played this player: http://www.gokickoff.com/team_player_detail.php?player_id=7620457. at that time, this was a 206.000 value, 9/2, 18 years old player.

i believe that all the connoisseurs will agree with me that such a player is absolutely worthless for Romania's national teams or any top national team, for that matter. but that player comes from the team of a friend of zsoka, a very vocal supporter. not only vocal, but also... rude, to put it mildly. take a look at the team's name:     Spargatorul De Buci Arad. it means ''but cracker Arad'' (Arad is a city). yes, it's an inappropriate, indecent spin on the nut cracker. this is the kind of people zsoka is associated with...

and the worst part is that ADMIN, even if he was informed about this team's indecent name, at least by 2 users, he ignores it!!!!

SHAME ON YOU, ADMIN! YOU ENCOURAGE CHEATING AND INDECENT BEHAVIOR!

in other games, this guy did the same thing with his team name, but the admins or gm's changed it and punished him. unfortunately, we don't have a responsible person in charge of this game.

marctiello

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Re: Training on NT
« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2014, 06:07:26 PM »
while i agree from the point of view of amc's, amr's and this sort of positions that can't play in bot teams, altogether i have to categorize the idea as detrimental, because of cheater nt and u21 coaches, that will bring ridiculous players from their teams or their friend's teams, only to get undeserved training.


I agree with Top Level. We are only human and there is the possibility that a lot of managers would eventually call useless players from their friend club. It would be good if all 22 NT players got training from each NT match, but it could turn back as a weak point of the game....
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Sir Vio Ferguson

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Re: Training on NT
« Reply #8 on: September 20, 2014, 07:35:58 PM »
I think is useless to speak about zsoka, he is the mother and father of cheating. I have mails from GM that recognized that he obviosly cheated, anyway like everywhere: money talk.
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Red

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Re: Training on NT
« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2014, 10:11:05 PM »
I think whole training system is very unfair and unrealistic...If some day developers will change something I would like to see:
1.No training from national games at all.
2.Much less experience from national games (about 1 star after 75 games)
3.Every national game  without option to change tackling which should be always at light level.
3.If a player play for national team in a game minimum 30 minutes his club owner should get more fans in next league game(not much just to pay out energy - 300-500 fans?)
And to equalize the level of training in our clubs:
1.For equalization of changes in national teams,players should lose progress rate after 22y. (+1 year when compare to current system)
2.Daily training should give much greater increase.
3.Match training should give much smaller incrase.
Those twaeks can create very fair system...
I will buy young players with PR 5 and higher,send me your offer.

top level

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Re: Training on NT
« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2014, 10:47:52 PM »
I think whole training system is very unfair and unrealistic...If some day developers will change something I would like to see:
1.No training from national games at all.
2.Much less experience from national games (about 1 star after 75 games)

first of all, to compensate for this, the injuries should be removed. i don't want my players to play and get injured for no reward. and spare me the 'be proud for having a player in a national team' line. in case i'm only exposed to the drawbacks, i don't care if my player is in nt or u21, i care if my team wins. if some of my players get injured every season from playing in national teams, at least now i get something out of it.


second of all, if they implement your ideas and there are still injuries, then many users that get extra youth players into academy for G or tokens would stop choosing smaller countries and go only for the 5 or 6 big ones, so their players won't get selected for national teams, unless they are la12-13 monsters. this migration to big countries would lead to the burial of medium and small nations and the creation of only a few super-powers, similar to what happened in youth camps.
1.For equalization of changes in national teams,players should lose progress rate after 22y. (+1 year when compare to current system)
this should happen anyway, because the PR of players has decreased and the academy players are, on average, over 17 y.o.
the 8 players i received at the season reset had an average age of 17,875. that is too high.
 if the average would be around 16, it would be ok the way it is now.
2.Daily training should give much greater increase.
3.Match training should give much smaller incrase.
i thought you were going for realism. what happened?
is it realistic to be able to train a player without playing him?
on the contrary, i think the training amount from matches should be a bit higher. but not too high, so it won't discourage the new teams from upgrading the training facilities.

Red

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Re: Training on NT
« Reply #11 on: September 20, 2014, 11:21:59 PM »
Ad.1
Agree,but with easy tackling possibility is very low.Perhaps maximum 5-6 days for injury can be good adjustment.And still players get some experience.
Ad.3
I was a player of team sport and single sport as well and I never train skills when I play competition game...I always train my skills during daily training,training games.Competitions games my coach did use to develope my or my team tactical skills and of course to collect experience.
I will buy young players with PR 5 and higher,send me your offer.

Brian Clough

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Re: Training on NT
« Reply #12 on: September 21, 2014, 12:08:45 AM »
I think whole training system is very unfair and unrealistic...If some day developers will change something I would like to see:
1.No training from national games at all.
2.Much less experience from national games (about 1 star after 75 games)
3.Every national game  without option to change tackling which should be always at light level.
4.If a player play for national team in a game minimum 30 minutes his club owner should get more fans in next league game(not much just to pay out energy - 300-500 fans?)
And to equalize the level of training in our clubs:
A.For equalization of changes in national teams,players should lose progress rate after 22y. (+1 year when compare to current system)
B.Daily training should give much greater increase.
C.Match training should give much smaller incrase.
Those twaeks can create very fair system...

Some more interesting ideas.  I changed your numbering system in my quote to make it easier to comment on.

1, I partially agree. However I'd say that all players on the NT should get a small training bonus, like what Sopelana originally proposed, whether they play or not.
2. I agree that experience from NT friendlies should be much smaller, but it is about right for competitive NT matches.
3. Easy tackling should be the only option for friendly matches. The options for WC qualification matches should be easy and normal, with the default set to easy (for bot teams). Hard tackling should only be an option during the WC group stage and knockout rounds.
4. Agree. Maybe the number of minutes a team's players play with their NT could be added to the base club rating, calculated weekly or the average of the past few weeks. Players' minutes on u21 NTs would count 1/3 as much. For example, a team has 5 NT players who play a combined 390 minutes and 5 u21 NT players who play a combined 390 minutes in a given week. The following week, the team's club rating is increased (390 + 390/3) = 520 points.

A. Partially agree. Players' PR should drop half of the current rate at age 21, then current rate beginning at age 22.
B. Agree
C. Agree, However I would add that experience gain from all competitive matches would be far greater than currently for players with low/very low experience, and a bit lower for players with good/very good experience. This way, the incentive for playing inexperienced players has more to do with experience gain rather than training gains. For example:
Experience            Modifier for experience gain from competitive matches
Very low                  4X
Low                         2X
Okay                       1X (no modification)
Good                       0,75X
Very Good                0,5X
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Drifter

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Re: Training on NT
« Reply #13 on: September 21, 2014, 04:31:24 PM »
 ;) I like your point about inexperienced players gaining experience faster and more experienced players gaining experience more slowly. Currently, it takes a lot of dedication to raise the experience levels of players. Allowing players with lower experience levels to improve faster would give more incentive to play younger players.
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LieCheatNsteal

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Re: Training on NT
« Reply #14 on: September 22, 2014, 02:07:31 AM »
it seems better from the current rigid ratio, but will it promotes nepotism or sumthing similar like that , this seems for a good idea for putting low CA and "claimed" to have 7~8+LA players in bench to "improve", i knew some NT do this, and maybe of course ME myself