Author Topic: [suggestion] settings to shape academy players' skill development  (Read 3008 times)

Brian Clough

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[suggestion] settings to shape academy players' skill development
« on: September 20, 2011, 11:37:15 PM »
It would be awesome if we could have settings to shape the development of youth players coming out of our academy, based on the club's preferred strategic and tactical style. They would include most of the "strategy" and "playing style" tactics settings, and would result in players that (are more likely to) fit these tactics better than the mostly random assignment of skills that happens now. Only if a user leaves all settings at "default" would they get a random assortment like now. For example:

Strategy (All attack to Contain): Attacking options would produce players with better attack stats than would be expected for a given position, at the expense of defensive ones, while defensive options would do the opposite. This would become more pronounced depending on the level of attack or defend you choose.  This is not to say that, by choosing "more defending", you'd end up with a FC with stats that look more like a DC, but your FC would have better defensive stats (e.g. passing and positioning) and worse attacking stats (e.g. finishing and off the ball) than would be otherwise produced.

I think that this could also work with "closing down", "marking", and "roaming" options, so new youth players would be more likely to fit one style or the other when they come out of academy, unless left at default setting. One could either use these settings to produce players that will fit their team's (future) strategic and tactical styles OR to get players that one thinks will be more marketable, if they just want youth players for the Gs they'll bring on the transfer market.

This suggestion is just for 4 settings that could easily fit on the "academy" page; nothing more, nothing less.


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intervention

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Re: [suggestion] settings to shape academy players' skill development
« Reply #1 on: September 21, 2011, 01:04:04 AM »
Ah yes a great idea.. took the thought out of my mind  :D

You should be able to make some changes in the academy to produce more specific players for your team
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Kr10s

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Re: [suggestion] settings to shape academy players' skill development
« Reply #2 on: September 21, 2011, 01:14:26 AM »
Too complicated, i believe every player should be different, aiming his gamestyle will only make all players the same. I believe in player's singularity. With this scheme you'll always have strong defenders and fast wingers (just an example), i believe each player gamestyle should be random......

In any case, i believe promoted players should be able to play in main squad's tactic, i'm tired receiving DMC/DMR/DML if i don't use them, just to be clear: i'm not asking for select promoted player's position, but i do believe a promoted player should at least fit in main squad formation..... then, if you receive a slow AMR, maybe he's got enough skill to compensate, or he's more creative, then you'd be adjusting your tactic to your current squad.

We should be able to change our gameplan after all, a team's gameplan canot last 10 years, every team need to evolve.
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Brian Clough

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Re: [suggestion] settings to shape academy players' skill development
« Reply #3 on: September 21, 2011, 01:57:58 AM »
CarlosT, what if the attack/defend strategy setting slightly weighted the probabilities of position proficiencies (other than GK) that came out of the academy either instead of, or in addition to, an effect on stats? In this scenario, the degree of attack/defend wouldn't affect the stats (other than a constant attack or defend stat weight), only the probabilities of a particular line coming out of the academy. For example:
"Contain" would produce few AM or FC proficient players, whereas "All Attack" would produce few DM or D proficient players. "More Attack" or "More Defend" would produce few D or FC proficient players, respectively. The categories "Attacking" and "Defensive" would have little effect on player proficiency probability, just weight the stats (slightly) as for all levels of attack or defensive strategies. Finally the Default setting would leave it as random.

The idea is that you set your academy to produce these kinds of players, but that you aren't guaranteed anything. What is one point added and taken away from key stats so you have a net zero change from the random stats? Maybe this could even be increased depending on academy quality? I don't think it would hurt the game if we can differentiate our academies to some degree. Importantly, these settings shouldn't allow academies to pump out highly specialized players ready for starting roles, but that they would weight the random statistic slightly...ever so slightly. If you want random, then leave the settings on default. ;)
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Kr10s

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Re: [suggestion] settings to shape academy players' skill development
« Reply #4 on: September 21, 2011, 02:14:54 AM »
There's not a team in the whole world that produces "kinds" of players, and i believe there's only 1 team in the world that produces players that fit exactly in main squad's strategies: Barcelona's La Masia.

The rest of the teams produces "individuals", that fit in main squad tactics or not......

Maybe your idea would be used at level 6 (max), not before......
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Brian Clough

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Re: [suggestion] settings to shape academy players' skill development
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2011, 02:59:00 AM »
You are right that clubs don't produce "kinds" of players in the sense of "goalscorers" or "great tacklers". However almost every club academy website I looked at claimed to be looking for "particular types of players for their academies". For instance, Tottenham says "Tottenham tend to look for a particular type of player for their youth Academy.  Players who are highly skilled but many of them are lightly built and their stature and physique may be a hindrance when it comes to that final step up in professional football." (LINK)
And from the BBC: "Manchester City's chief football operations officer Brian Marwood has said the club's new academy is an attempt to create 'a different type of player'." (LINK)

This doesn't mean they're going to create superstars, or increase player potential ability in our analogy here. It just means that different academies have different staffs with their different skill proficiencies, etc. that ultimately add up to slight, but fairly consistent, differences in skill development (though these differences can become more pronounced with very smart teams, like Barca. Maybe they just have the right set of staff to produce players with the skills that will fit into the clubs strategy and tactics, which is what makes them so good. You just start with the base (random) stats, and adjust a few of them up and down (based on this choice) so there's no net change in stat figures. Furthermore, it doesn't guarantee anything:

Say you like to use the Man marking tactic and so you set your academy setting there. The random-stat generator pumps out a defensive player who is naturally suited to Zone marking (by chance) with low stats in key stats for Zone. By subtracting 1 or 2 points from Zone stats and adding them to the Man marking stats yes, the player would become better suited to man marking (and worse at zone marking), but they would still stink at Man marking. So a 1 point change in those key stats would only increase the likelihood that you would get a player that was better at your preferred tactic by 5%. That makes the increased probability that your academy will produce a player that is best suited to all 3 of your primary tactics close to zero (5% cubed = 0.000125). That would be level 3 or 4; level one would only get 1 out of 3 or 4 stats weighted this way. Level 6 might double this, offering a 10% odds increase (1/1000 for all 3) which is a significant, yet far from overwhelming incentive for upgrading this expensive facility. 

Maybe instead of decreasing the cost of facility upgrades, there should just be more benefits that come from them... ;D

edit: checked math
« Last Edit: September 21, 2011, 05:04:04 AM by Champione »
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Re: [suggestion] settings to shape academy players' skill development
« Reply #6 on: September 21, 2011, 05:58:38 AM »
IMHO, specific training should be enough to shape the promoted players.

gabrielis

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Re: [suggestion] settings to shape academy players' skill development
« Reply #7 on: September 21, 2011, 06:43:32 AM »
You can sell a player if he doesn't fit you

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Re: [suggestion] settings to shape academy players' skill development
« Reply #9 on: July 05, 2023, 04:07:54 PM »
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Re: [suggestion] settings to shape academy players' skill development
« Reply #11 on: October 05, 2023, 06:12:48 PM »
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Re: [suggestion] settings to shape academy players' skill development
« Reply #13 on: January 05, 2024, 10:51:13 AM »
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Re: [suggestion] settings to shape academy players' skill development
« Reply #14 on: February 22, 2024, 06:52:26 AM »
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GregoryUnubs

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Re: [suggestion] settings to shape academy players' skill development
« Reply #15 on: February 22, 2024, 07:25:07 PM »
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